But in my opinion, our perspective compared to the massive nature of the Universe and multiple dimensions in space and limited linear time then yes that "hologram" would be our "insect perspective" compared to the true huge reality of the Universe and what's in it instead of what we just see in front of us with our basic senses.
Only the Spirit (energy) being freed from its Vessel (body) can possibly see beyond the 3 dimensional reality (hologram).
Loukas Papas - These losers are so full of SSHhhhhhhhhh I can't wait til a meteor lands on their 3 d @$e$
Reg Clinton Brown - I didn't even read the article just the headline and I'm tired of people using the word "hologram" or "matrix" because we are NOT plugged in into a machine to dream our reality.
But I'd rather say that our interaction with the 3 dimensional world is just a "smaller perspective" to the bigger picture.
DK Knighton - Please let me know when they find this universal Hologram projector.
Because until they do it seems these guys are smoking some strong stuff.
Muhammad Rasheed - Reg wrote: "...because we are NOT plugged in into a machine to dream our reality."
It's a machine made out of bio-tech tissue, not metallic machinery like in the movies. The spirit is the real world, while this terrestrial realm is only a finite machine programmed to test the sentient beings of the universe.
Reg Clinton Brown - LOL @ DK Knighton exactly... I hate when people wanna talk about something deep and just throw around inappropriate words like "hologram" or "matrix" cuz they popped too many "RED PILLS" Bye Morpheus :)
Reg Clinton Brown - Yes, Muhammad I know we are "Bio-Mechanical" organisms that contain a "Life Force/ Soul" that is presently experiencing their 3 dimensional reality within a multidimensional existence.... still not a "hologram" lol
Muhammad Rasheed - You're letting the semantic choices get you into a tizzy and letting it distract you from the significance of the correlations. It's fascinating to me, but philosophical stuff isn't for everyone. If you allow the package to prevent you from enjoying the food within it, that's something you just missed out on and for the next person to pick up.
Reg Clinton Brown - Ok, do I need an interpreter to break down your comment Muhammad?
The word "hologram" means "to project light and it's colors into an image giving the illusion of a 3 dimensional object(s) or person(s)." ...etc
We are not plugged into a "machine" but rather our Souls are energies that are interconnected to all the energies in the Universe. When the body dies, the soul moves on elsewhere since matter changes form but never destroyed whereas energies are kinetic and travels extremely fast. So our current lifetime "experience" may be a "projection of the 3 dimensional experience into our brains that interprets that outside stimuli within our inner soul." and if energies are as old if not older than the Universe itself then that means our Souls are OLDER than our actual body age. Interpret that in any form you wish.
Muhammad Rasheed - It doesn't have to be a technically accurate hologram, as it was used as an analogy. Again you are getting upset over the semantics and side-stepping the real point, even if the direction of the article's author is off skew. The analogy still points to the ancients being right about this world being the illusion and the spirit being real. That's clearly the important part. Whether they worded it in modern sci-fi type talk isn't the point at all, and to harp on that only serves as a distraction. To me.
Reg Clinton Brown - It's not a distraction, people need to learn with specifics and not getting confused with science fiction (the Matrix films, for example) that were inspired by real life ancient knowledge, mysticism and spiritualism that was here at our disposal since the beginning of time.
Even though movies and television programs do subconsciously attempt to "enlighten" to masses of this knowledge in the form of creative fiction it also causes "confusion" of people not knowing if that knowledge was imaginary or real since in the beginning of creation.
People sometimes don't see that religion and science actually compliment each other.
Muhammad Rasheed - If the analogy helps people get interested in learning about it, drawing them in to the subject, then there is no harm. How many people enter fields of endeavor because they were inspired by a technically inaccurate film, like King Kong or something equally unbelievable? I think your stance is too strict.
Reg Clinton Brown - And science fiction can help the masses in thinking "outside of the box" beforehand so when that fiction is proven possible or true in the real world then it won't be too much of a shock to the blindfold being removed. That blindfold causes limited thinking and that's the true "hologram".
Muhammad Rasheed - If I don't know anything about the subject, and out the gate you want to bombard me with technical jargon and high-level concepts, it will function as inaccessible, and turn people away. The pop cultural references function as icing to lure 'em in. People often have life-long loves for science because they found some silly novel or show that they loved as a child to inspire.
Reg Clinton Brown - Muhammad, I'll be real with you... I have experienced Lucid Dreams and sometimes keep a log of it written. It seems that once I realize that I'm dreaming within the dream I can do ANYTHING I want, including jumping off tall buildings or cliffs and landing softly on my feet... fighting off an entire army of demons by myself holding a tree stick that turned into a Bo Staff...flying... and even punching and breaking bricks in a wall one by one with my bare hands. I was in control. Now that in itself was incredible but I can't figure out if that dream was just my subconscious imagination at work or was my soul at a different place while my body was asleep. So yeah, maybe I am being too "strict" with the analogy.
DK Knighton - Reg bottom line is, like so many of us we are tired of so called scientis trying explain what they'er unable to explain.
I mean it's OK for scientis to just say "Hey, we just don't know".
Scientis can't accept that there is a Most High and that he has revealed some of what he did and hid a lot of what he did.
Reg Clinton Brown - I agree for the most part, some things scientists are on point with it when it's applied and proven BUT when it comes to things like the "Big Bang" theory or things dealing with types of energies involved with the consciousness of the Soul and Spirituality or the Origin Of Creation in a scientist's viewpoint is ALL THEORETICAL and I give those theories some consideration while giving the "side eye".
Walt Huffman - Read The "Galactic Milieu Trilogy" and its prequels. Then read The philosophy of Pierre Teilhard de Chardin Reg Clinton Brown. I believe it will inspire you.
Reg Clinton Brown - Thanks Walt, I'll look those up. I was wondering when you'd jump into this type of conversation. Does those books (both fiction and philosophical) deal directly with aspects of Life Forces and/ or Lucid Dreams vs Reality?
Muhammad Rasheed - Reg wrote: "...BUT when it comes to things like the 'Big Bang' theory..."
Big Bang theory absolutely supports the biblical origin of the universe. That's why when the 20th century scientists "just went with it" they made great strides in physics. By contrast the modern scientists, who hate Big Bang's implications and waste all of their time trying to disprove it, are stagnant.
Walt Huffman - They deal with the fact that mind direcly influences matter and how every object in the universe, wether considered sentient or not has an amount of energy with which the mind may interact. The key concept is de Chardin's idea that all mind and every object in the universe contributes to the univesal "noosphere" or the field of vital energy that gives rise to ever more complex intellect. Chardin believes that everthing has some measure of life force and lucid dreaming is just another aspect of consciouness and is not mutually exclusive with life force but the same "kettle of fish".
Reg Clinton Brown - Well yes Muhammad, the "Big Bang" theory is an example of how science and religion does compliment each other but only if you read the Bible and most Holy Books in a "contextual" mindset instead of "literal".
Meaning, if you look at Chapter 1 Genesis, it states "literally" that "first there was darkness and then there was light and the light is good" OR "the Earth was created in 6 days"... in a "contextual" point of view a "Day" in God's perspective could be "6 Million Years" or "6 Billion Years" or "6 Trillion Years".
Also scientists also based the Big Bang theory from monitoring the positions of the galaxies from telescopes (Hubble) showing that the galaxies are spreading apart and then eventually gravity will pull all the galaxies together and implode into the "BIG CRUNCH" which would/ could restart another "Big Bang" in the super distant future. Pattern repeats...
Reg Clinton Brown - So Walt, pretty much that can imply that if we were able to open up our Chakras beyond the basic 3 Chakras most use to higher points of the Kundalini all the way up to the 7th level then we could open our "Third Eye" through spiritual awareness through prayer and meditation.
Sometimes it feels like my states of dreaming in my sleep acts like a form of mediation or prayer connecting your energy to the Universe outside of your body so in essence "closer to God" or the "God Energy" that connects everything in matter and consciousness.
Muhammad Rasheed - Reg wrote: "Well yes Muhammad, the 'Big Bang' theory is an example of how science and religion does compliment each other but only if you read the Bible and most Holy Books in a 'contextual' mindset instead of 'literal.'"
Sacred scripture is multi-layered, and designed to be understood on a basic surface level, and at higher levels of thought based on the individual reader's maturity. All texts are to be understood "in context."
Reg wrote: "Meaning, if you look at Chapter 1 Genesis, it states 'literally' that 'first there was darkness and then there was light and the light is good'"
One would think that there would be a great deal of light emanating from a "big bang" after an impossible level of mysterious darkness.
Reg wrote: "OR 'the Earth was created in 6 days'... in a 'contextual' point of view a 'Day' in God's perspective could be '6 Million Years' or '6 Billion Years' or '6 Trillion Years.'"
The original word in Hebrew -- the sister equivalent to the Arabic word used for the same concept in the Qur'an -- is "youm." This word is a term used for an indeterminate, but steady and regular, amount of time expressed in the abstract. When God originally told Moses He created the earth in six "youm," no one was under the delusion that He meant six twenty-four hour periods. It was only the English translators, who only THOUGHT they understood what the texts they were guarding meant, who were responsible for the flaw.
Walt Huffman - The concept of the "noosphere" makes such distinctions immaterial. Life forces and lucid dreams are all aspects of de Chardin's "noosphere". There is no vs. reality because they are all aspects of reality. Everything in the multiverse posseses some amount of life force wether sentient or not. The noosphere is the collective life force of everything in the universe. As our population becomes more extensive the noosphere becomes more complex. Our brains, our "souls" if you will become complex. We are electical creatures and the field of the noosphere becomes more sublimely intertwined and we evolve mentally and spiritually. Our brains and nerves are chemically and electrically active. Add enough electrical nodes and intelligence and spiritually manifest in greater and greater "Fields of Spatial Interaction". (Also the Maori believe "Dream Time" is more signifigant than "Real" time). Electrical and other esoteric energies are measurable and can affect the "Real" universe. And "Dreams" are definitely electrical energy. Pierre Teilhard de Chardin is definitely worth investigating.
Reg Clinton Brown - YES, exactly Muhammad so you OVERSTAND what I'm saying then! My Brotha! :)
Reg Clinton Brown - Interesting.... Muhammad and Walt feel free to discuss more amongst yourselves. I'm going to log off for awhile and do some research.
I'll be back later. Thanks
Muhammad Rasheed - "The Galactic Milieu Series of science fiction novels by Julian May is the sequel (and prequel) to her Saga of Pliocene Exile. It comprises four novels: Intervention, Jack the Bodiless, Diamond Mask and Magnificat. The series involves several religious and philosophical themes, including references to the work of Pierre Teilhard de Chardin."
Muhammad Rasheed - "'God writes straight with crooked lines.' This proverb summarises the plot of the whole series, in which tragedies and disasters (particularly the Metapsychic Rebellion) result in ultimate good."
Muhammad Rasheed - "The series includes multiple references to the work of Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, including the concepts of the Omega Point and the Noosphere, which are applied to May's description of galactic mental Unity. The series title echoes Teilhard's 1957 book Le Milieu Divin."
Walt Huffman - Muhammad Rasheed I would like to discuss theses ideas further with you and Reg Clinton Brown. Intellects of any orientation are the meat and drink of my existence.
Muhammad Rasheed - "Pierre Teilhard de Chardin was a French philosopher and Jesuit priest who trained as a paleontologist and geologist and took part in the discovery of Peking Man. He conceived the idea of the Omega Point (a maximum level of complexity and consciousness towards which he believed the universe was evolving) and developed Vladimir Vernadsky's concept of noosphere."
A European philosopher born in the late 1800s who believed the universe was evolving [becoming] in a linear fashion towards a greater, ultimate state, is my ideological enemy.
Muhammad Rasheed - That's the frame work skeleton of the pseudo-scientist racist view that humans evolved from primitive brown spiritual people UP to sophisticated white scientific people. I am not surprised to find others of that ilk fascinated and expanding upon the topic in their own works. I am distrustful of the concepts that even remotely sound like it.
Walt Huffman - Muhammad, why would he be your enemy? Perfection of consciousness and the Omega Point would be the ultimate achievenent.
Muhammad Rasheed - Paradise, granted by the One God who was pleased that you met the requirements for such, would be the ultimate achievement. A human civilization designed to optimally allow humans to achieve that state, would rank second.
What de Chardin was dreaming about represented a white man's fantasy that makes me instinctually distrustful based on the normal route of intellectual thought in those old circles. That's why I recognize the flavor of that particular taint.
But I'm open to hearing a logical counter-argument as to why I shouldn't feel that way. Please provide it. Thus far I am impressed with your passion.
Walt Huffman - Muhammad you are distrustful of mental evolution? This has nothing to do with skin color. How about Malama Johnson in May's books.
Walt Huffman - Religion and science are not mutually exclusive. The Omega point is essentially oneness with the ultimate mind (God) of the universe.
Muhammad Rasheed - "Mental evolution" is an individual's walk, grounded in a deliberate, open and honest quest for an intellectual, emotional, and spiritual higher IQ. How does it function in the series? With standard telekinesis, telepathy, and clairvoyance?
Muhammad Rasheed - Walt wrote: "Religion and science are not mutually exclusive."
I never said they weren't. But de Chardin's concepts certainly aren't 'science.' They're a belief system built upon an arrogant, wishful thinking model of a newly growing racist view of world origin. If the white man represents the highest evolved human to date, then these kinds of concepts are the logical extension of that fully-fleshed out model.
Walt wrote: "The Omega point is essentially oneness with the ultimate mind (God) of the universe."
God is One, and truly unique by definition. How could such a thing as a joining with oneness possibly be? Tell me.
Muhammad Rasheed - (i recognize that i might be coming across as harsh in this discussion, Walt. please understand that it is only the 'sound' of my writing voice, and is not an attack against you. I'm just challenging it to test the strength of your argument. Peace)
Muhammad Rasheed - Reg wrote: “Muhammad, I'll be real with you... I have experienced Lucid Dreams…It seems that once I realize that I'm dreaming within the dream I can do ANYTHING I want […] So yeah, maybe I am being too 'strict' with the analogy.”
From the examples shown in the life of the biblical Joseph (may the peace of God be upon the prophet), I believe the human dream is more than just sleepy movie images. Dreams can tap into spirit. It is not insignificant that Joseph conspicuously didn’t go around interpreting any and everybody’s dreams, nor did everybody ask. Only certain people who had certain types of dreams. This is the clue for how they actually function. Most dreams ARE just sleepy movie images, but sometimes… for reasons known only to God… they tap into the Otherside to give us a message for something we need to prepare for in our lives (the dreams Joseph interpreted were always precognitive in nature).
Now is it possible that the people who have lucid dreams have actually experienced an altered state of consciousness, and are exploring another realm, the fabric of which being fascinatingly pliable to the explorer’s mind? Sure. 2% of the population actually does have the ability to have an altered state of consciousness without the aid of hallucinogens. It’s also possible that the people who have lucid dreams have only partially awakened, enabling them to perform mental tricks they wouldn’t if they were fully asleep.
But is there a way to tell either way? I don’t think so. Consequently, until our science/tech evolves to the point where we can test such things accurately and obtain definitive results, dreaming stories fail to move me outside of what the prophet was able to do with the permission of his Lord Most High.
Reg Clinton Brown - *reads comments*
Interesting, while I was researching ya'll were providing material. Thanks
Good reading right here :)
Reg Clinton Brown - Good breakdown on "Lucid Dreaming" Muhammad, I've heard this before. Over the years I've been connecting a few dots based on what I've experienced, to what was being taught, to my own private research over the years with various books. There were a few times that the dream felt like an "out of body experience" in real time... like my body was asleep but my spirit was elsewhere similar to the concept of "Remote Viewing" which I read up on a few years back when I was reading books of an ethereal nature. I use to say it's like my soul was attached to my body like a stretched out "astral umbilical cord" then later I read books that described it that way and was called "Astral Projection".
Some dreams are just simple dreams but what I just described didn't feel like that.
Reg Clinton Brown - ALSO, when I watched that movie Inception a few years back I said to myself did Nolan experience Lucid Dreams too?
Because even though I didn't care for the movie's convoluted story of dream layers upon layers, I understood what they were trying to put across.
Reg Clinton Brown - Muhammad, I should pick up the Bible and re-read the Book Of Joseph.