Bruce Ramsey - OMA!!! On top of this, there is a hadith that says that he who sucks the tongue of Muhammad, will avoid "the fire". I don't know about you, O Muslim, but this sounds like a catch-22 situation. Oh that Mo.
[MEME] showing image of Arab man holding a child
Muhammad Rasheed - Did AI make this? Why are the hands, feet and eyes so wonky...?
Bruce Ramsey - Maybe the "Shaitan" made it.
Muhammad Rasheed - The image alone seems innocent enough, despite the draftsmanship wonkiness. It's the meme's message that incorporates it that's 'shaitan' inspired.
Bruce Ramsey - You don't believe the hadith that inspired it?
Muhammad Rasheed - Why would I willynilly believe everything finite humans claimed in the hundreds of thousands of collected biographical ahadith narratives, especially if it didn't align to the Qur'an, or at least, the character of the prophet that was known to be of a high standard?
The hadith are not the divine Word of God. Only the Qur'an fits that role. Why don't Christians understand that basic 'Islam 101' principle after all these centuries of discussions between us?
Bruce Ramsey - If the hadith is written by finite humans, how can you believe any of it? WHY have your patooti up in the air five times a day on a prayer rug? WHY wash your nose out three times if Satan HASN'T spent the night in it? WHY say a prayer before entering a bathroom with your left foot if Satan DOESN'T play with your ass? THINK, please.
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "If the hadith is written by finite humans, how can you believe any of it?"
Allah said to believe in Him and perform the religion the way His prophet performed it. So, the believers collected the narratives of how the prophet did everything in his daily life. I believe the hadith that align to the Qur'an and remain indifferent to the ones that don't do this, or are in general questionable.
Bruce wrote: "THINK, please."
You keep saying that to me, but frankly, I don't find your intelligence to be up to even an average bar in these discussions. You need to take a step back and look at all of this with an objective eye. Your pet religious ideology makes you silly and unable to focus it seems...
Bruce Ramsey - So, you cherry pick from the hadith, I see. I've noticed that sahih (sound/authentic) no longer means that, but, anything in the hadith that doesn't embarrass a Muslim about Mr. (pbuh).
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "So, you cherry pick from the hadith, I see."
You don't understand what the hadith actually are. There are literally hundreds of thousands of those narratives collected within entire libraries dedicated to ahadith alone. Literally everybody "cherry-picks" them because it's more material than anyone can read in a single lifetime. Plus, they are supposed to be picked through because the entire purpose for the collection is to see how Muhammad (pbuh) performed the rituals of Islam so we can copy him. The rest of them are just bonus material.
Bruce wrote: "I've noticed that sahih (sound/authentic) no longer means that"
No, it means you are incorrect about what 'sahih' actually entails. Instead of being a typical biased outsider and assuming something about a religion you don't know anything about, you really should just ask. Unless, of course, your goal is to slander, lie and sow mischief in the earth.
Bruce Ramsey - If the hadith is as you claim, sounds like something you can't trust. Thus, why be a Sunni Muslim? Sunnis are called "Sunni" because they "follow the sunnah/hadith". Anyway, sahih USED to mean "sound". I noticed that it no longer means that. Sahih NOW means ANYTHING that doesn't make Mo look stupid, or crazy or evil.
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "If the hadith is as you claim, sounds like something you can't trust."
Some you can trust, others you can't... the same as with any other collected body of human testimony.
Bruce wrote: "Thus, why be a Sunni Muslim? Sunnis are called 'Sunni' because they 'follow the sunnah/hadith.'"
I claim no sects. I am only a Muslim. This is sufficient.
Bruce wrote: "Anyway, sahih USED to mean 'sound.' I noticed that it no longer means that. Sahih NOW means ANYTHING that doesn't make Mo look stupid, or crazy or evil."
lol "Sahih" references a custom-developed methodology that Bukhari, Muslim, etc., used as their quality check criterion. If the interviewee passed that sahih test, then the hadith was collected from them. Sahih is not a reference to the authenticity of the hadith narrative itself, only that the person repeating it had no ulterior motive, or whatever. That's all. "Sahih" does not mean that the repeated narrative was automatically true.
Bruce Ramsey - M. Rasheed wrote: "Some you can trust, others you can't..."
And you trust some when they don't make Mo sound crazy, stupid or insane, true?
M. Rasheed wrote: "the same as with any other collected body of human testimony."
IF that testimony is what you agree too, GOT it.
M. Rasheed wrote: "I claim no sects. I am only a Muslim. This is sufficient."
Well, you certainly aren't a Sunni, that is for sure.
M. Rasheed wrote: "lol 'Sahih' references a custom-developed methodology that Bukhari, Muslim, etc., used as their quality check criterion. If the interviewee passed that sahih test, then the hadith was collected from them."
You mean, if it didn't make Mo sound evil, or stupid, or insane.
M. Rasheed wrote: "Sahih is not a reference to the authenticity of the hadith narrative itself,"
It USED to mean that. "Grade sahih" means "sound/authentic".
M. Rasheed wrote: "only that the person repeating it had no ulterior motive, or whatever. That's all. 'Sahih' does not mean that the repeated narrative was automatically true."
And 'alaqa' no longer means 'clot of blood' but 'clinging leech like thing' AND 'spread out like a carpet' NOW means 'earth shaped like as ostrich egg.'
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "IF that testimony is what you agree too, GOT it."
There is more collected human testimony about prophet Muhammad (pbuh) than any other historical figure. The nonsense fraudulent narratives stand out because they are inconsistent with the greater work, as well as Allah confirming that His servant was of excellent character. You only want the obviously fake hadith to be real because you are a transparently biased outsider.
Bruce wrote: "Well, you certainly aren't a Sunni, that is for sure."
In the Qur'an, Allah says not to break the religion up into sects. so, all the Muslims who enthusiastically claim to be sunni, shia, suffi, etc., etc., will have to answer for that foolishness on the Day of Judgment. You may encourage it as you like, but that stance only shows you as a transparently biased outsider who wants to sow mischief.
Bruce wrote: "And 'alaqa' no longer means..."
You're babbling. In your effort to mock the material, you confused ayahs with hadith and sound like a loon.
Bruce Ramsey - Again, "alaqa" no longer means "clot of congealed blood" it now means "clinging leech like thingy". By the way, Muhammad says in the hadith (which you apparently don't believe in), that there will be 71 sects of Jews and only one sect of Jews will escape "the fire". There will be 72 sects of Christians and only one sect of Christians will escape "the fire", and there will be 73 sects of Muslims, and only (well, you know the pattern). But, it's pointless to talk hadith with you since you don't believe in the hadith and aren't a Sunni Muslim, true?
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "Again, 'alaqa' no longer means 'clot of congealed blood' it now means 'clinging leech like thingy.'"
Is this Qur'an translation comparison somehow relevant to the hadith part of the discussion?
Bruce wrote: "By the way, Muhammad says in the hadith (which you apparently don't believe in)"
Did I say I didn't believe in any of the ahadith, or did you just whip out a strawman effigy fallacy with a flourish? lol
Bruce wrote: "that there will be 71 sects of Jews and only one sect of Jews will escape 'the fire.' There will be 72 sects of Christians and only one sect of Christians will escape 'the fire,' and there will be 73 sects of Muslims, and only (well, you know the pattern)."
What about it?
Bruce wrote: "But, it's pointless to talk hadith with you since you don't believe in the hadith"
Copy/paste the post where I said I didn't believe in the hadith, please.
Bruce wrote: "and aren't a Sunni Muslim, true?"
I do not claim the sunni sect, nor any other. I am only a Muslim.
Bruce Ramsey - And you DO believe in the hadith? But, ONLY the hadith that doesn't make Mo sound crazy, stupid or evil, I can imagine, even if it's written by Bukhari.
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "And you DO believe in the hadith?"
I said exactly what I believe about the hadith, but you twisted it into something completely different. I started to get angry about it, until I remembered that's how your entire religion actually functions. You ignore what is plain, unambiguous and explicit, to prefer to just make up stuff by connecting dots that don't make any sense to connect. I don't think you can help yourself at this point, it's just how you think out of long practice turned habit.
Bruce wrote: "But, ONLY the hadith that doesn't make Mo sound crazy, stupid or evil, I can imagine"
Allah confirmed that His servant was none of those things, so what would I look like taking the position of the hostile, biased outsider? What sense would that make?
Bruce wrote: "even if it's written by Bukhari."
Bukhari didn't write anything; he just compiled hadith narratives from a bunch of people he interviewed. Your knowledge base in the material is very low, yet you are campaigning hard to force a very specific narrative about it. It's weird.
[81:22]
[53:1-4]
[34:46-47]
Bruce Ramsey - Muslim: The "I am he" in John 8;25 is? Who's he? He is Judas. John 13;26. Judas took the place of Jesus in death on the cross
Kufr: So JUDAS takes away the sins of the world when he goes to the cross? JUDAS is the "lamb" that makes sense of all the sin offerings and blood atonement described in the TORAH ("Allah's book given to Musa")?!?! JUDAS is the one who makes sense of the SPOT-LESS Passover Lamb's blood shed and put over doorways to keep the Angel of Death from killing the FIRST Born of Israel? JUDAS is the one foreshadowed as the metallic IMAGE of a snake on a stick held up by "Musa" to keep the Israelis from dying of snake venom when the Israelis would look up and SEE the IMAGE of the metallic snake on a stick HELD up by "Musa"!?! REALLY!?! LOL! 🙂
Bruce Ramsey - Do you need to wash your nose out three times? If you do, what is the reason for it?
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "The 'I am he' in John 8;25 is? Who's he?"
It could be whoever the anonymous writer who wrote the fiction wanted it to be. Why would your biblical fan-fiction matter to me?
Bruce wrote: "Do you need to wash your nose out three times?"
Yes.
Bruce wrote: "If you do, what is the reason for it?"
Rinsing out the nose is part of the ablution cleansing ritual (wudu) that is mandatory before prayer. Allah uses water to purify the believers—to change their state from common-to-holy—as in the baptism ritual of the previous prophets.
Bruce Ramsey - So you wash your nose out THREE times, NOT because you believe Mo was right about Satan spending the night in it, but, because you feel it's good for you? Never heard of a brain-eating amoeba, I see. But, forget that single celled creature, you DO wash your nose out THREE time, because you feel it's GOOD for you and NOT because Satan spends the night in it, true?
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "So you wash your nose out THREE times, NOT because you believe Mo was right about Satan spending the night in it"
No. I'm confident that's not a real story you're referencing.
Bruce wrote: "but, because you feel it's good for you?"
To remove from me the stain of the satan, to strengthen my heart, and to plant my feet firmly in my faith as Allah lists in the highlighted portion of the Qur'an verse I quoted above. Allah says He loves those who keep themselves clean & pure, commands that the believers perform the ritual ablution before prayer and His prophet showed us how to do so.
Washing up before prayer takes me from the common state to a holy stat so I am properly prepared to speak to my Lord & Cherisher who made me.
Bruce wrote: "Never heard of a brain-eating amoeba, I see."
Sure, I have. 🙄
Bruce wrote: "But, forget that single celled creature"
I already have. 🙄
Bruce wrote: "you DO wash your nose out THREE time"
Yup.
Bruce wrote: "because you feel it's GOOD for you"
See my explanation above.
Bruce wrote: "and NOT because Satan spends the night in it, true?"
Quite true. smh
Bruce Ramsey - M. Rasheed wrote: "No. I'm confident that's not a real story you're referencing."
It's sahih (sound) hadith. You don't believe sahih (sound) hadith?
M. Rasheed wrote: "To remove from me the stain of the satan, to strengthen my heart, and to plant my feet firmly in my faith as Allah lists in the highlighted portion of the Qur'an verse I quoted above."
NOT because Satan "spent the night in" your nose, like Muhammad says in sahih (sound) hadith, true?
M. Rasheed wrote: "Allah says He loves those who keep themselves clean & pure,"
Did you know in Sunan Abu Dawud Mo "takes ablution" in the "Well of Bud'ah" that is on par with a modern day sewer? IF You DO know this hadith, do YOU think taking "ablusion" in that will make you clean?
M. Rasheed wrote: "commands that the believers perform the ritual ablution before prayer and His prophet showed us how to do so."
By bashing in something on par with a sewer? Check THIS out, please:
كتاب الطهارة1 Purification (Kitab Al-Taharah)
(35)Chapter: What Has Been Narrated Concering The Well Of Buda'ah(34)باب مَا جَاءَ فِي بِئْرِ بُضَاعَةَ
Narrated AbuSa'id al-Khudri:
I heard that the people asked the Prophet of Allah (ﷺ): Water is brought for you from the well of Buda'ah. It is a well in which dead dogs, menstrual clothes and excrement of people are thrown. The Messenger of Allah (ﷺ) replied: Verily water is pure and is not defiled by anything.
Abu Dawud said I heard Qutaibah b. Sa'id say: I asked the person in charge of the well of Bud'ah about the depth of the well. He replied: At most the water reaches pubes. Then I asked: Where does it reach when its level goes down ? He replied: Below the private part of the body.
Abu Dawud said: I measured the breadth of the well of Buda'ah with my sheet which I stretched over it. I them measured it with the hand. It measured six cubits in breadth. I then asked the man who opened the door of garden for me and admitted me to it: Has the condition of this well changed from what it had originally been in the past ? He replied: No. I saw the color of water in this well had changed.
حَدَّثَنَا أَحْمَدُ بْنُ أَبِي شُعَيْبٍ، وَعَبْدُ الْعَزِيزِ بْنُ يَحْيَى الْحَرَّانِيَّانِ، قَالاَ حَدَّثَنَا مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ سَلَمَةَ، عَنْ مُحَمَّدِ بْنِ إِسْحَاقَ، عَنْ سَلِيطِ بْنِ أَيُّوبَ، عَنْ عُبَيْدِ اللَّهِ بْنِ عَبْدِ الرَّحْمَنِ بْنِ رَافِعٍ الأَنْصَارِيِّ، ثُمَّ الْعَدَوِيِّ عَنْ أَبِي سَعِيدٍ الْخُدْرِيِّ، قَالَ سَمِعْتُ رَسُولَ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم وَهُوَ يُقَالُ لَهُ إِنَّهُ يُسْتَقَى لَكَ مِنْ بِئْرِ بُضَاعَةَ وَهِيَ بِئْرٌ يُلْقَى فِيهَا لُحُومُ الْكِلاَبِ وَالْمَحَايِضُ وَعَذِرُ النَّاسِ . قَالَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم " إِنَّ الْمَاءَ طَهُورٌ لاَ يُنَجِّسُهُ شَىْءٌ " . قَالَ أَبُو دَاوُدَ وَسَمِعْتُ قُتَيْبَةَ بْنَ سَعِيدٍ قَالَ سَأَلْتُ قَيِّمَ بِئْرِ بُضَاعَةَ عَنْ عُمْقِهَا قَالَ أَكْثَرُ مَا يَكُونُ فِيهَا الْمَاءُ إِلَى الْعَانَةِ . قُلْتُ فَإِذَا نَقَصَ قَالَ دُونَ الْعَوْرَةِ . قَالَ أَبُو دَاوُدَ وَقَدَّرْتُ أَنَا بِئْرَ بُضَاعَةَ بِرِدَائِي مَدَدْتُهُ عَلَيْهَا ثُمَّ ذَرَعْتُهُ فَإِذَا عَرْضُهَا سِتَّةُ أَذْرُعٍ وَسَأَلْتُ الَّذِي فَتَحَ لِي بَابَ الْبُسْتَانِ فَأَدْخَلَنِي إِلَيْهِ هَلْ غُيِّرَ بِنَاؤُهَا عَمَّا كَانَتْ عَلَيْهِ قَالَ لاَ . وَرَأَيْتُ فِيهَا مَاءً مُتَغَيِّرَ اللَّوْنِ .
Grade: Sahih (Al-Albani) صحيح (الألباني) حكم :
Reference : Sunan Abi Dawud 67
In-book reference : Book 1, Hadith 67
English translation : Book 1, Hadith 67
M. Rasheed wrote: "Washing up before prayer takes me from the common state to a holy stat so I am properly prepared to speak to my Lord & Cherisher who made me."
Bruce: Even if you have particles of dead dogs up your nose?
M. Rasheed wrote: "Sure, I have. 🙄"
Don't you think the "well of Bud'ah" might have something like that in it?
M. Rasheed wrote: "I already have. 🙄"
🙂
M. Rasheed wrote: "Yup."
But, not with water like the "well of Bud'ah", true? But, you feel it is GOOD for youm true?
M. Rasheed wrote: "See my explanation above."
And?
M. Rasheed wrote: "Quite true. smh"
Muhammad Rasheed - Are you still under the impression that your cherry-picked, random hadith should mean more to me than the Noble Qur'an, the source text of Al-Islam and the revealed Word of God on earth? Because that's what it seems like you posted that for.
The hadith do not trump the Qur'an. For nearly 1400 yrs, we've been having these discussions between the two faiths and you still don't understand basic Islam 101 principles. That bull-headedness taints your witness, bud.
Muhammad Rasheed - You seem to recognize that I know too much about the corrupt mess called Pauline Western Christianity and could NEVER convert to it, so you've switched tactics to trying to smear Al-Islam as your consolation prize.
But you're approaching it from the position of a person who seems to have only discovered Islam a week ago and still never bothered to learn what it's about before you went on your attack.
You sure have a lot of confidence in your personal sophistry tricks.
Bruce Ramsey - M. Rasheed wrote: "Are you still under the impression that your cherry-picked, random hadith should mean more to me than the Noble Qur'an,"
Hey, nice to see my comment to you was allowed on, after all. Oh, you mean the hadiths Muslims reject because they make Mo sound crazy? So you DON'T believe you can take ablution in a sewer? Hey, that's a start.
M. Rasheed wrote: "the source text of Al-Islam and the revealed Word of God on earth? Because that's what it seems like you posted that for."
You must not be a Sunni, for a Sunni Muslim is to believe what the hadith says. It's quite apparently you DON'T believe you can take the water of a sewer and use it for ablution.
M. Rasheed wrote: "The hadith do not trump the Qur'an. For nearly 1400 yrs, we've been having these discussions between the two faiths and you still don't understand basic Islam 101 principles. That bull-headedness taints your witness, bud."
Did you know that the QURAN (not hadith) but the QURAN says that if there is no water for ablution, you can use "clean" soil? Thus, do you snort "clean" soil up your nose to cough Satan out?
Bruce Ramsey - M. Rasheed wrote: "You seem to recognize that I know too much about the corrupt mess called Pauline Western Christianity and could NEVER convert to it, so you've switched tactics to trying to smear Al-Islam as your consolation prize."
You just don't believe Paul, because, Paul said he met Jesus on the Road to Damascus. IF Paul said he was all alone in a cave, getting squeezed to near death by an angel of light every time he said he couldn't read, to the point he ran out of the cave thinking he was demon possessed, YOU would then believe what Paul says, true?
M. Rasheed wrote: "But you're approaching it from the position of a person who seems to have only discovered Islam a week ago and still never bothered to learn what it's about before you went on your attack."
You want to see how far back I've been exposing Islam? Here you go: [link to Bruce's personal YouTube site]
M. Rasheed wrote: "You sure have a lot of confidence in your personal sophistry tricks."
You mean knowledge of Al Islam. Yes I do. I've been a student of Christian Prince since 2006.
Muhammad Rasheed - Are you really trying to appropriate my style on Black History Month? That's messed up...
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "You want to see how far back I've been exposing Islam?"
"Exposing" Islam using sophistry isn't a thing. You have to actual address the claims of the religion and then prove them untrue. The blatant use of fallacious arguments isn't that.
Bruce wrote: "You mean knowledge of Al Islam. Yes I do."
I'm willing to believe you may actually think that about yourself, but the fact that you do believe that random, cherry-picked hadith should hold more weight than the Qur'an itself (the actual source text of the religion and the inerrant Word of Allah) demonstrates you don't know the religion at all, and just copy canned arguments from anti-Islam hate websites without studying the faith for yourself.
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "Hey, nice to see my comment to you was allowed on, after all."
??? Why wouldn't it be?
Bruce wrote: "Oh, you mean the hadiths Muslims reject because they make Mo sound crazy?"
The ones that are clearly false because they don't align to the Qur'an, nor to basic common sense. lol
Bruce wrote: "So you DON'T believe you can take ablution in a sewer?"
No. Allah says He loves those believers who keep themselves pure and clean. Obviously sewage would be the opposite of that. We're not even allowed to make prayer in the restroom.
Bruce wrote: "Hey, that's a start."
A 'start' to what?
Bruce wrote: "You must not be a Sunni"
I claim no sects; I am only a Muslim. That will sufficeth.
Bruce wrote: "Did you know that the QURAN (not hadith) but the QURAN says that if there is no water for ablution, you can use 'clean' soil?"
Yes. I had to do it myself a couple of times while on an adventure.
Bruce wrote: "Thus, do you snort 'clean' soil up your nose to cough Satan out?"
lol No. Allah says we just have to wipe our hands and lightly pat our faces with it, and He'll accept the prayer.
Bruce Ramsey - I've interjected my thoughts with Muslim since 2007. By the way, speaking about Black History Month, did you know Muhammad was a white, crackah who owned black slaves and said that if you want to see what Satan looks like see Nabtal Ibn Harith (a black man)?
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "You just don't believe Paul, because, Paul said he met Jesus on the Road to Damascus."
That was clearly a blatant lie and of course I don't believe him. I also reject him because he pointedly avoided the disciples of Jesus (pbuh)—an obvious red flag—tainted the message with Greco-Roman trinitarianism to appeal to the pagan gentile, and later when the disciples did find Paul and ask him about it he lied to their faces. lol But most damning for your boy is when he officially prophesized that the Christ would return during his own lifetime. This didn't happen, which formally labels Paul of Tarsus as the false prophet of legend, hence why God had him executed per Deut. 18:20.
Bruce wrote: "IF Paul said he was all alone in a cave, getting squeezed to near death by an angel of light every time he said he couldn't read, to the point he ran out of the cave thinking he was demon possessed, YOU would then believe what Paul says, true?"
Why would that matter? Clearly Paul was a lying wretch, so you can swap out the "met Jesus on the Road to Damascus" fable with any other story and he would still be a lying wretch who deserved to have his lying head cut off.
Bruce wrote: "I've been a student of Christian Prince since 2006."
I've maybe heard the name before...? But I'm mostly unfamiliar. A brief search shows him as a sideshow freak. Is that where your fallacy-laden, sneaky, trick-bag argument style comes from? Figures.
Bruce Ramsey - Muslims cherry pick what they want to believe even from the "clear signs". Why do you think not ALL Muslims joined ISIS when they came upojn Quran 9:111? I don't cherry pick anything. I mean, if I'm going to make my point, I don't pick from the hadith that has Muhammad saying to not chop down a tree, OK?
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "I've interjected my thoughts with Muslim since 2007."
I don't know what that means.
Bruce wrote: "By the way, speaking about Black History Month, did you know Muhammad was a white"
lol No, he wasn't. Here:
********************
According to the celebrated 9th century scholar Al-Jahiz, the prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) was a black man:
"The ten sons of Abd el-Mottalib [the grandfather of Mohammed] were all black and strong; so was Abdallah ibn Abbas, Mohamet's cousin. The members of the family of Abu Talib [a relation of Muhammad and the father of the Sultan Ali] were all more or less Negroid in color." ~Al-Jahiz (776 AD - 868 AD), an excerpted translation from his essay "The Superiority in Glory of the Black Race Over the White" published by G. van Vloten, tria opposcula auctore, Abu Othman Amr ibn Bahr AIDjahiz, Basrensi Leyden, 1903
"What Al-Jahiz says about the Negro strain in certain great Arabs is supported by other writers, European as well as Arab. For instance, he says that the sons of Abd el-Mottalib, the grandfather of Mohammed, were Negroes, which in turn would make Mohammed a Negro." ~J.A. Rogers, World's Great Men of Color, Vol I
*********************
Bruce wrote: "crackah"
A "cracker" is a poor white person who traces their lineage to the poor whites of Old England. They are showcased in the titular essay of Thomas Sowell's book "Black Rednecks and White Liberals." I don't see how the term is relevant in this context. I think you confused yourself again.
Bruce wrote: "who owned black slaves"
The Muhammad (pbuh) freed his slaves upon receiving his prophethood commission.
Bruce wrote: "and said that if you want to see what Satan looks like see Nabtal Ibn Harith (a black man)?"
lol The satan is not a human being. 🙄
Bruce Ramsey - M. Rasheed wrote: "??? Why wouldn't it be?"
Because I was exposing Islam too well?
M. Rasheed wrote: "The ones that are clearly false because they don't align to the Qur'an, nor to basic common sense. lol"
Having meteors burning up in the earth's atmosphere being literal stars is "basic common sense"? Having a place of setting (a muddy spring) is "common sense"? Having a giant molten metal wall holding back Gog and Magog people on earth is "common sense"? Speaking of which, WHERE is that giant molten metal wall holding back the Gog and Magog people to the end of the world?
M. Rasheed wrote: "No."
NO!?!?!
M. Rasheed wrote: "Allah says He loves those believers who keep themselves pure and clean."
Clean" soil does that?
M. Rasheed wrote: "Obviously sewage would be the opposite of that. We're not even allowed to make prayer in the restroom."
So you REALLY don't believe Sunan Abu Dawud hadith about Mo and the "well of Bud'ah", true?
M. Rasheed wrote: "A 'start' to what?"
Rejecting the teaches of Islam. Now, I've noticed, not even sahih of Sunan Abu Dawud is believed.
M. Rasheed wrote: "I claim no sects; I am only a Muslim. That will sufficeth."
So you have no problem with Ahmadis or Sufis or Shia, true? They are just as Muslim as you, true?
M. Rasheed wrote: "Yes. I had to do it myself a couple of times while on an adventure."
And you felt clean after doing it, true?
M. Rasheed wrote: "lol No. Allah says we just have to wipe our hands and lightly pat our faces with it, and He'll accept the prayer."
Why do you then after to snort water up your nose and risk getting a brain eating amoeba? Why not treat the water like you do the "clean" soil?
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "Muslims cherry pick what they want to believe even from the 'clear signs.'"
You're speaking as a hostile, heavily-biased outsider who happens to be envious that Christianity didn't get to be the favored religion of God. Your bitter and silly opinions don't mean anything at all to me. Should they?
Bruce wrote: "Why do you think not ALL Muslims joined ISIS when they came upojn Quran 9:111?"
lol uhhh... Because they recognize that 9:111 is talking about one of the specific battles in early Islam's history as is not a call for all of us to join a terrorists group founded by a joint CIA/Mossad operation that conspicuously slaughters more innocent Muslims than anyone.
Bruce wrote: "I don't cherry pick anything."
Okay, then the anti-Islam hate websites you frequent did all the cherry-picking, and you just copy/paste them. Either way, the spirit is the same. You'd be better off reading the Qur'an and a bio of the prophet for yourself instead of being an unrepentant hellbound stooge of hatred.
Bruce Ramsey - This guy presents the hadiths and tafsrs that have Mo as white. [David Wood YouTube link]
Bruce Ramsey - Did you know that Mo taught that a giant monster would come up out of the earth at the end of the world to turn you white for "the garden" and black for "the fire"? Mo was a racist white crackah devoh.
Muhammad Rasheed - What's a "devoh?"
Bruce Ramsey - Oh, eexcuse me... "devil".
Muhammad Rasheed - Oh, I see. You're supposed to be mocking my ethnic group's American English dialect.
You don't think that taints your witness, too?
Bruce Ramsey - I've just heard it pronounced as "devoh" so much, it sticks.
Muhammad Rasheed - Did you?
Muhammad Rasheed - I didn't recognize it. I guess all the white folk who dress up in blackface in your circles pronounce it like that when they're mocking us.
Bruce Ramsey - Did I what?
Bruce Ramsey - I think you're right.
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "Did I what?"
Heard the word pronounced the way you spelled it.
Bruce Ramsey - Devil? Devoah? Well, how do YOU pronounce it? By the way, if I was black, Islam would be the LAST religion I'd be a part of.
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "I think you're right."
Of course. That's a huge part of why Pauline Western Christianity is completely soiled for me, even outside of the bible's numerous errors and corruption. Your folk basically wiped your arses with it. I don't want it. Too much baggage.
Bruce Ramsey - Did you know slavery is fine in the Quran? Check out Quran 2:178, please. By the way, which is worse? Saying blacks are destined for "the fire" or me pronouncing "devil" and "devoah"?
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "Devil? Devoah? Well, how do YOU pronounce it?"
I'm from the Mid-West of the USA, so I have that accent, with a sprinkling of my dad's Ole Miss.
Bruce wrote: "By the way, if I was black, Islam would be the LAST religion I'd be a part of."
lol You don't know enough about Al-Islam to make such a claim.
Bruce Ramsey - M. Rasheed wrote: "Why would I believe something that directly contradicts God?"
Where does the Quran say NOT to wash in a sewer when you can you "clean" soil?
M. Rasheed wrote: "I have a problem with all those who break their religion up into sects and proudly rep those 'colors' in defiance of the Word of Allah. They will have to answer for that willful disobedience on the Last Day."
Then you have a problem with Sunnis, for they see their sect as the true sect... UNLESS they are trying to convince you that Islam is the world's fastest growing religion, then they even include Shia as Muslim.
M. Rasheed posted: "'Holy Qur'an 6:159: As for those who divide their religion and break up into sects, thou hast no part in them in the least: their affair is with Allah: He will in the end tell them the truth of all that they did.'"
And SUNNIS don't do that, true? 🙂
Bruce Ramsey - Seems it would have been more merciful of Allah to say you don't need to do the ablution if there is no water around. But, we can't have that, can we, for that opens the door up to cleansing when you really need it.
Bruce Ramsey - M. Rasheed wrote: "If I were you, I would be less worried about catching a rare ailment, and more worried about the certainty of Eternal Torment you have in your future lest you repent and convert to Al-Islam."
Oh, so the water up your nose, or, the dirt, is NOT to get Satan out of it, but, to avoid "the fire"? Hmmm.
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "You don't have a problem with that? How come you don't have a problem with that?"
Why would I have a problem with God's instructions to keep murderous blood feuds going until whole tribes were wiped out? God said if one person gets murdered, then you're only allowed a strict "eye for an eye" revenge killing. That's all. But He encourages the offended party to forgive and strengthen their soul in the "turn the other cheek" concept.
Bruce wrote: "Where does the Quran say NOT to wash in a sewer when you can you 'clean' soil?"
I don't understand what you mean. God's instructions were clear: Use water for wudu and if there is no water, then use clean earth in the manner described. What are you going on about 'sewers' for after God revealed His clear instructions?
Bruce wrote: "Then you have a problem with Sunnis"
I have a problem with anyone breaking their religion up into sets in defiance of Allah's command. I claim no sects. I am only a Muslim.
Bruce wrote: "then they even include Shia"
They are all Muslim if they meet the requirement. The problem is that other thing that counts as a sin.
Bruce wrote: "And SUNNIS don't do that, true? 🙂"
Don't do what?
Bruce wrote: "Seems it would have been more merciful of Allah to"
You sound retarded. Are you going to second guess the All-Knowing One God? wtf?
Bruce wrote: "Oh, so the water up your nose, or, the dirt, is NOT to get Satan out of it, but, to avoid 'the fire?' Hmmm."
I already posted the Qur'an's verse that described what the water does spiritually, but here in response you just made up something and ended it with "Hmmmm" in perfect imitation of a strawman effigy fallacy.
Bruce wrote: "Why does a slave have to be killed instead of the slave master who killed him?"
Because God's rule is that old "eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth" requirement. If the chief of the tribe was killed, then the opposing party's chief must die in exchange. If a slave, then a slave in return. It's God's rule of equality in this matter.
Bruce wrote: "Slaves aren't worth as much as masters in Islam? Mm mm mmmmmmm."
You're mixing two different points.
Bruce wrote: "So she can have TWO husbands!?!?"
A free woman wouldn't have two husbands, since he's forbidden to marry her if she is already married as I said.
Bruce wrote: "Oh, it's VERY obvious."
I don't think you know what that means. lol
Bruce wrote: "Where is the consent of her husband whose town you might have slaughtered? WHERE is the consent to just make it adultery?"
Slaves have no rights in that regard. But if they ask to be able to buy their freedom, you must give it to them.
Bruce wrote: "No, it's called 'reading the Quran verse without blinders on.'"
At no point have you done this.
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "Where does it say 'enslaved hand maidens belonging to your wife?'"
• your right hand = spouse
• possesses = your spouse's servant
Muhammad Rasheed - Bruce wrote: "By the way, again, ahem.. WHERE is the consent of her husband whose town you might have slaughtered? WHERE is the consent to just make it adultery?"
I'm not sure what you are asking here. You wrote it in a convoluted mess. Be clearer, please.
Bruce wrote: "Again, YOU don't see how just those TWO scriptures on slavery EASES African American complaint for the time the US had slavery?"
No. Plus, why would I isolate two verses out of the Qur'an's greater context about slavery as if those two versus alone represented a separate Islamic doctrine? Christians treat their "scripture" in that way; there's no logical reason to actually do it.
Bruce wrote: "THINK, please."
I would've thought you'd learned your lesson from the last couple of times you typed that. You always look like a fool.
