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CITATION
Rasheed, Muhammad. "The Unlearned Foe." Cartoon. The Official Website of Cartoonist M. Rasheed 10 Jun 2021. Pen & ink w/Adobe Photoshop color.
ARTIST'S DESCRIPTION
This #MRasheedCartoons image was created as a cover to the dialog below I engaged in with an atheist cartoonist who expressed the belief that all three Abrahamic faiths believe they hold individual doctrinal monopolies over who gets to receive ever-lasting life from God or not. The Qur'an of Al-Islam is quite unambiguous on this score, and I grabbed a couple of several verses that made my point. Interestingly, instead of attempting to pull verses of his own to prove his point, he's currently just trying to rhetoric me to death in a live debate.
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Muhammad Rasheed - Johnny Hart said: “Jews and Muslims who don’t accept Jesus will burn in hell."
I wouldn't be a Muslim is I didn't accept Jesus (peace be upon him).
Mason Mastroianni - Rough one.
My grandfather and I spent countless hours in attempt of swaying one another’s worldview from what we were each convinced was dead wrong.
My grandfather spent the latter half of his life as a devout born-again Christian. I can say from my experience with him, his words are often mistaken, out of context, or exploited for impact. Still, his faith allowed little wiggle room for understanding the minds of those who did not share it.
And, I’d challenge any truly faithful to argue against the tenants of their own faiths in doing the same. All three religion here profess exclusive access to the kingdom of God, and anyone versed enough to claim membership of any of the three, would be lying if the said that heaven would allow a ‘pass’ for members of the remaining two.
It’s a cheap shot to say ‘this Christian says Jews and Muslims will go to hell,’ when it is literally what their Holy book says on every other page. It’s not bigotry; it’s orthodoxy. Its not opinion; it’s faith. It’s not racism; it’s RELIGION. Say it for what it is. I’m a proud atheist for a reason.”
Muhammad Rasheed - Mason wrote: "All three religion here profess exclusive access to the kingdom of God, and anyone versed enough to claim membership of any of the three, would be lying if the said that heaven would allow a ‘pass’ for members of the remaining two. "
The atheist position is similar to the stand-up comedian's position... you put together your quips based on what sounds good to you, not on whether it's true or not. lol
Mason wrote: "It’s a cheap shot to say ‘this Christian says Jews and Muslims will go to hell,’ when it is literally what their Holy book says on every other page. "
"Literally," huh? In my experience arguing with the atheist, your position is the unlearned position. It would be more fun to argue with you if you first studied the scripture and had an actual, fact-based critique to pull from. Just making up what you only think scripture says and arguing against it in the classic strawman fallacy – makes you stand on shaky ground before you even start.
The Holy Qur'an - 2:62
Those who believe in the Qur'an, and those who follow the Jewish scriptures, and the Christians and the Sabians—any who believe in the One God and the Last Day, and work righteousness—shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.The Holy Qur'an - 2:111-112
111. And they say: "None shall enter Paradise unless he be a Jew or a Christian." Those are their vain desires. Say: "Produce your proof if ye are truthful."
112. Nay, whoever submits His whole self to the One God and is a doer of good, He will get his reward with his Lord; on such shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
Muhammad Rasheed - *mic drop*
Mason Mastroianni - First, I’m a religious studies major; I know the holy books well.Second, atheism is a dynamic stance, not a position based on ‘what sounds good to me.’ In fact, you’re interpretation of holy text seems to fill that exact role.
Third, Atheism is nothing more than the denial of theism. it is not a faith; it is not a club; it is not exclusive, and it doesn’t believe those who do not share its realization are destined to everlasting damnation in the afterlife.
If you’re going to pretend that the big three monos don’t doom each other to hell, then you’re either mistreating the holy texts, or misinterpreting them in some weird modern apologist guise. This isn’t difficult to prove; it’s a historical fact.
Don’t insult my understanding of faith unless you know where it comes from, and what it is. Insult the tenants of that faith itself.
Mason Mastroianni - Side note: I have ZERO problem with you or your faith. But, I don’t share it. I’m responding to you because of the attacks made against my grandfather, who’s faith I also do not share. When I see Muslims, Jews, or Christians attack one another regarding tenants of faith, I try to take a moment to impress that it is the faith, and not the person, who is either being attacked, or doing the attacking.
Muhammad Rasheed - Mason wrote: "I know the holy books well"
Clearly not. Note that the verses I pulled from the Qur'an were right up front in the second chapter.
Mason wrote: "Atheism is nothing more than the denial of theism. it is not a faith"
You believed by faith that the source text of my religion said something it did not say.
Mason wrote: "misinterpreting them in some weird modern apologist guise"
I copy/pasted those verses directly from the Abdullah Yusuf Ali English translation. lol
Mason wrote: "Don’t insult my understanding of faith"
I just proved that you lack an understanding of faith. You should stick to atheism since that's where you put all of your brain power efforts.
Mason wrote: "I’m responding to you because of the attacks made against my grandfather"
Well, I didn't attack your grandfather. I saw his quote and merely set the record straight regarding the matter of Muslims accepting Jesus. The Pillar of Al-Islam called "BELIEF IN THE PROPHETS" means it is mandatory that I accept the Christ and believe in his message as part of my salvation as a Muslim.
Mason Mastroianni - I have read the holy books; I know what they say.
If you were not insulting my grandfather directly, you were certainly insulting him in passing by posting that article in a group dedicated to the strip.
If you knew me better personally, you’d know that I know what I’m talking about when it comes to religion, it’s historical impacts, and it’s holy texts’ interpretations. My grandfather was a biblical literalist, a modern movement in evangelicalism that denies the Bible’s impacts and interpretations after the normalization of scientific method. It’s a movement I don’t value the tenants of, but it’s an arguably legitimate interpretation.
If you personally do not see your faith as dooming other faiths to eternal damnation, then I applaud you. You’re obviously a member of a modern, more humanistic, cosmopolitan iteration of interpretation. It is not difficult to point too many, many, many, historical interpretations of your holy text that would put you at odds with what you personally believe. There are many modern ones as well.
Oh, and as with any other holy text, and the quotes you cite are contradicted in numerous other quotes. No need to get into all of that; we both already know that it is true.
Mason Mastroianni - With respect
Muhammad Rasheed - Mason wrote: "I have read the holy books; I know what they say."
Clearly not.
Mason wrote: "you were certainly insulting him in passing"
No. Your grandfather is a famous public figure who was quoted in a major US publication saying something very wrong about my religion. Since I as a practicing Muslim was invited to contribute to this group dedicated to his work and philosophy, how could I not post what I posted? Please be reasonable.
Mason wrote: "you’d know that I know what I’m talking about when it comes to religion"
I literally just copy/pasted the verses from the Holy Qur'an that proved you were wrong about Islam.
Mason wrote: "If you personally do not see your faith as dooming other faiths to eternal damnation"
I literally just copy/pasted directly from the actual source text of the religion of Al-Islam regarding Allah's revealed position on exactly that subject. lol
Mason Mastroianni - I have read them, and I addressed each point your making here already. I even pointed out that the quotes you posted are contradicted in many instances. I have no reason to lie; I opened this convo by confessing that I am a religious studies major.
Second, I also just explained that my grandfather was a biblical literalist. He didn’t ‘think something is wrong with your religion.’ He quoted the Bible, which clearly says in multiple places, that if you do not accept the divinity of Christ as the one true savior, you will not enjoy the kingdom of heaven.
Back to my original point: insult the faith, not the person. He chose his faith, and his interpretation. He loved Muslims, and wanted them to share the kingdom of heaven with him. He simple couldn’t see past what he believed to be the word of God.
Please don’t pretend that you don’t understand orthodoxy as it applies to these faiths. I know that you do; we all do.
Muhammad Rasheed - Mason wrote: "I have read them"
Your original comment that directly contradicted the Qur'an proved that you have not.
Mason wrote: "and I addressed each point"
Do you think empty rhetoric that you just made up "addresses" the point? How does that work?
Perhaps you should try posting actual verses that prove your point and force me to surrender?
Anytime you're ready.
Mason Mastroianni - You want me to post every verse and text that Muslims use to excuse the destruction of non-Muslims? Or how about the ones Christians use? You really want them all? That’ll take me back to my undergrad days. It’s a waste of time, sir, as is any excessive attempt to prove the Blatantly obvious.
Unless, of course, you just want to gloss over ever holy war in human history, including what’s currently happening in the Middle East.
I’ve made the only points clearly. I’m not interested in pretending.
The problem you have with my grandfather isn’t him; it’s the faith he ascribes to. Attack the faith.
Muhammad Rasheed - Please post verses from the Qur'an that prove your original contention that Islam believes it hold a monopoly over who gets to go to paradise and that Jews and Christians are excluded because they are Jews and Christians.
Throw down your rod, please. Thank you.
Mason Mastroianni - Quran (9:29): “Fight against Christians and Jews until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low.”
Quran (5:51): “Don’t take Jews or Christians for friends. If you do, then Allah will consider you to be one of them.”
Quran (2:65-66): “Christians and Jews must believe what Allah has revealed to Muhammad or Allah will disfigure their faces or turn them into apes, as he did the Sabbath-breakers.”
Quran (5:51): “O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people.”
Quran (9:30): "And the Jews say: Ezra is the son of Allah; and the Christians say: The Messiah is the son of Allah; these are the words of their mouths; they imitate the saying of those who disbelieved before; may Allah destroy them; how they are turned away!"
Just a start
Muhammad Rasheed - "Just the start" of what?
Muhammad Rasheed - Please post verses from the Qur'an that prove your original contention that Islam believes it hold a monopoly over who gets to go to paradise and that Jews and Christians are excluded because they are Jews and Christians.
Mason Mastroianni - Oh sure.
Muhammad Rasheed - Note that none of the verses you just posted addressed that topic.
Mason Mastroianni - If you’re a strict literalist. Are you?
Muhammad Rasheed - You made a very strict and specific claim in your original post, did you not?
Mason Mastroianni - Btw, I like Islam. I like it much better than Christianity. But I’m not into pretending that it’s something it isn’t
Muhammad Rasheed - I'm content with you managing to stick to the subject. lol
Mason Mastroianni - Did you read the quotes?
Muhammad Rasheed - lol Yes, that's why I'm asking you post quotes that prove that Allah will exclude Jews and Christians from paradise because they are Jews and Christians. Do you have those? Please post them.
Mason Mastroianni - It is clear in them. I am not sure what you’re missing
Muhammad Rasheed - It's "clear in them" how?
Mason Mastroianni - Do you not know the meanings of Islamic lore? Do you not know the context of these quotes?
Mason Mastroianni - I think you must
Muhammad Rasheed - It's clear you do not.
Mason Mastroianni - Wow
Mason Mastroianni - Well, ok
Muhammad Rasheed - "Well, ok" what?
Mason Mastroianni - We are at an impasse, and I accept that
Muhammad Rasheed - We are not at an impasse, Mason.
You're just being disingenuous.
Mason Mastroianni - I would like to discuss this further, but I have some pressing items at the moment
Mason Mastroianni - I am not sir
Mason Mastroianni - You can disagree with me, but DO NOT call me a liar.
Don’t do that
Muhammad Rasheed - Stop being a liar then.
Muhammad Rasheed - I'll breakdown each of your quotes in context...
Mason Mastroianni - This isn’t a debate. You are attacking me
I don’t care for it, and I don’t respect it
Muhammad Rasheed - ...while you go find the actual quotes that prove your original contention.
Mason Mastroianni - And I’m sorry to say, this is the sort of behavior I’ve come to expect from the convicted.
Mason Mastroianni - I said I’d like to discuss it further. You laughed at that
Muhammad Rasheed - You're the one being disingenuous and lying because you can't admit you are wrong. #atheistfaith
Mason Mastroianni - I have a job, sir. I’d like to be able to tend the needs of that before continuing a debate that will require time, research, and reflection
Mason Mastroianni - Laugh of you like.
Mason Mastroianni - I am a traditional atheist; not a new age one
Mason Mastroianni - I don’t expect you to know the difference, but I am willing to explain
Muhammad Rasheed - Why would I be interested in that instead of in you proving your original contention? lol Focus, please.
Mason Mastroianni - I intend to prove it
Will you allow me the grave of time to complete my work tasks, or are you more interested in ‘winning’ than debating?
Mason Mastroianni - I’d also like to take time to hear your side
Muhammad Rasheed - Mason quoted: "Quran (9:29): 'Fight against Christians and Jews until they pay the tribute readily, being brought low.'”
This is in reference to Jews/Christians living in Muslim majority ruled countries. It means they have to pay the tax if they want to stay. It has nothing to do with them as doctrinal believers of their own faiths winning paradise or not.
Mason Mastroianni - I know what it means sir
Muhammad Rasheed - You keep saying that.
Mason Mastroianni - I’m not sure if you heard me the two times I said that I am a religious studies major
Mason Mastroianni - I am well versed
Mason Mastroianni - These quotes are subject to various interpretations, and I know what they are in historical context. The Christian Bible is very similar in these regards
Muhammad Rasheed - If you know what it means, then why did you post it in place of the verse that proved that Allah will exclude Jews and Christians from paradise because they are Jews and Christians as you originally claimed since that is what you were supposed to be looking for?
Mason Mastroianni - Because of its context. Literally the next question I asked you. I assumed you understood it’s historical and lingual context because you are a member of the faith
Again, I’m happy to build in it. It will require some research, which I will do. I have no issue with it, but I cannot do it right now
Mason Mastroianni - Respect that?
Muhammad Rasheed - What about it's context? God said as long as they continue to believe in Him, do good and reject evil they will get their reward. That has nothing to do with paying a tax to the Muslim governments.
Mason Mastroianni - I answered you
Are you too angry to wait? Is it an issue of feeling triggered? If it is, we can end the debate with no hard feelings
Muhammad Rasheed - Are you interpreting my attempts to keep you on task as "anger?" Curious.
Mason Mastroianni - I really do need to get to work. If you are asking for me to add more, I will do so.
I am considering it to be disrespectful, as I’ve told you four times now that I do not have the tile at this moment
Muhammad Rasheed - I'm functioning as both debate combatant and moderator in one. lol
Mason Mastroianni - If the situation was reversed, I would not act in this way towards you
Mason Mastroianni - No, you’re not
Muhammad Rasheed - You reached out to me, Mason. If you have to go, then just go. You're being weird.
Mason Mastroianni - May I complete y work and return to this later?
Mason Mastroianni - Another insult. Ok. Bye
Muhammad Rasheed - Mason wrote: "Another insult. Ok. Bye"
🙄 lol smh
You guys are a trip, I swear...
Mason Mastroianni - I think I’m done. Let’s drop the debate. Be well and have a good day.
Muhammad Rasheed - Mason wrote: "No, you’re not"
Oh, yes, I am. lol
Note your numerous attempts to switch the topic to literally everything but the original topic? Keeping the debate on task is the job of the moderator, but you interpreted the activity as "strict literalist" which proved you've never engaged in a formal debate before since being kept on task is so alien to you.
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