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Joel Gray - Will African-Americans ever receive or deserve reparations?
Muhammad Rasheed - The Black American ethnic group—descendants of the American chattel slaves—deserve Reparatory Justice for the generations of economic-based anti-Black systemic racism inflicted upon them since the early seventeenth century up into the present day. Of course that means the actual wrong of systemic racism also needs to be dismantled, otherwise we can realistically expect all of those Reparations payout checks to be plundered right back into the wealth coffers of the white racist aristocracy.
Currently, the new crop of Democratic politicians and the anti-racism activists are fighting to address the racism-caused economic disparities, and since the battle is being fought, it can be won. It’s hard to win if you never fight it turns out.
Mic Worthy - Welp... LOL
Jason Hargrove - the only way to get reparations is to sue one of these businesses that had slaves then you would have to prove lineage to the slave that was owned. the government sanctioned slavery but it only ever paid reparations to the internment camp victims and heirs of ww2 not something too long ago.
Jason Anderson - In order to get reparations, you need to take from individuals TODAY. No one today has owned a slave. So are we going to go to the grand children, the great grand children or whatnot, and just demand they give us their property? I've always been courious how people have wanted to confront this issue...
Ollie Doss - But you don't mind building on the wealth that slavery produced. Do you? If you're willing to accept the benefits of a system founded upon slavery, you'll accept the punishment too. Yes, you very much so have a lot to do with slavery. So do your children and grandchildren. So, stop with backwards guilt tripping.
Jason Anderson - @Ollie...s fun fact, digging into my ancestors I personally have no connections to slavery. So no, I dont have anything to do with it. And it's not guilt tripping, its educating. You're just gunna take from those that weren't involved? What if that individual down the family tree is barely financed? Just gunna take everything even if they had no idea what their ancestors did?
Jason Anderson - However I agree those who took part need to own up to it. Do some research and you'll see NOT ONE REPUBLICAN owned a slave, REPUBLICANS were those that opposed it. If you want reparations take from the democratic leaders...
Ollie Doss - @Jason... I'm supposed to feel bad for taking from people who take from everyone else to build their lifestyles? No. It doesn't matter if you have no biological lineage to slavery. The American system is founded upon slavery. The white class of this country benefits from black oppression... to this very hour. Were it not for the stolen land and stolen wealth, this country might still be, but not in this form. So, I don't think black people should have any reservations nor apologies for taking from people whose ancestors took from them and who benefit from their continued oppression.
Muhammad Rasheed - The chattel slave institution is just one component of the Reparations law suit. The full scope of Reparatory Justice is the continuous anti-Black systemic racism inflicted upon Black people in this country for the last 400 yrs. Reparations will repair the generations of economic damage caused to Black people during the maintenance of the white racist aristocracy.
Timothy Brown -@Jason... you do have something to do with slavery because you're still benefiting from the economic structure slavery created. Republicans of the time still benefited from the economic structure of slavery. Oh, and fun fact, the civil war was less about freeing the slaves and more about keeping the country together. Many Republicans and Northeners were fine to keep slavery going, especially the longer the war dragged on. And you can't forget that the parties have flipped positions since the civil war. So the Republicans of today would align themselves more so with the Democrats of the civil war. You should do more research on the subject.
John Slaughter - @Jason... That's a fun fact until you do 30 seconds of research and discover that those "republicans" were the liberals and the "democrats" at the time were the ultra conservatives. So you could just as well argue that modern-day racist conservatives should solely shoulder the blame for it. I mean, they *do* have most of the US' wealth. Hell, I'm now paying more in taxes for their huge tax breaks.
That said, we're supposed to be a group for discussing the artwork, not critiquing the message of the art. I see there are yellow highlights on the white cloak/hood, but the torch doesn't appear to actually be lit.
Timothy Brown - And it is the government's job to provide reparations for the slavery they built an entire economic system on (our economic system still relies on similar structures and hasn't changed that much). So why shouldn't that same governing body years later not be held responsible for providing reparations?
Muhammad Rasheed - It's not highlight, John, it's 'dingy funky stuff.'
Ollie Doss - First of all, I love your work!!! Secondly... and, sorry in advance for the essay...
Reparations are usually given to nations, not a bunch of angry individuals. So, I'm of the belief that if black people are gonna go for reparations they need either their own nation or they need to organize in a manner that will allow for the money that they receive to help build a nation on the continent of Africa. Asking for reparations as just simply black people could be very, very dangerous, and set us up for a real genocidal attack. Black people still misunderstand the psychology of their enemies. We're not organized, so we're just approaching reparations as a bunch of individuals who want a check but have no political nor economic agenda after receiving that check. A shrewd politician would parlay that ignorance into a more sophisticated form of oppression. Because once those checks are cashed, white people have cut your legs out from under you. See, once the United States pays black people on an individual basis for the crimes of slavery and Jim Crow, racism won't exist anymore. So, now, this system can treat you however it wishes and your protests will be muted by the payment you received. In other words, approaching reparations the wrong way is likely to take from black people the only real leverage that they have in this country. That would be disastrous. So, reparations could be a very good thing for our people if we organize and make some type of agenda for the money. Just saying.
Muhammad Rasheed - In many of my cartoons, I have the activist characters holding dual signs that say both "End anti-Black systemic racism" and "Pay Black Reparations." Both will have to go hand in hand for the exact reasons you state.
Ollie Doss - @Muhammad... Agreed. So, are you of the mind that there should be some kind of economic agenda and organization in place prior to approaching reparations?
Muhammad Rasheed - I think there will need to be a gov sub-branch responsible for the payout. Like the one England created when they paid reparations to all of their slave-owners as the condition for freeing the slaves. That shit ran ran like a well-oiled machine and was done in 3-days. lol
Muhammad Rasheed - But dismantling the racist system should definitely be a part of the event. Paying Reparations means the USG acknowledges the wrong in the first place, and as you can see from this thread alone, white people like to pretend racism ended when slavery formally ended because they are trying to hide from racism and what they really owe.
You can't admit to the evils that are going on, be willing to pay the damages, but still keep the system up and running. That's retarded.
#LetMyPeopleGo
Ollie Doss - @Muhammad... But, we're dealing with a bit of a different situation here in America. I don't know that a sub-branch would vibe with the real owners nor the middle-class whites of this country. I don't see any way of actually getting reparations outside of some form of nationalistic organization or a full-on established nation.
Muhammad Rasheed - Ollie, I don't think the whole thing can play out without a full scale Civil War 2.0 anyway. We're just going to have to deal with it.
#StrapUpOllie Doss - @Muhammad... Oh, wholeheartedly agree with you on that. Furthermore, they still benefit from not only the wealth which slavery produced, but also from the economic apartheid practices of America. That's why they get so defensive and go on a weird guilt trip to try and make black people feel bad for approaching reparations.
Muhammad Rasheed - By sub-branch, I mean a special department under an already established gov entity (dept. of Commerce, Homeland Security, or whatever).
Ollie Doss - @Muhammad... I agree that a fight will ensue. However, I also think that if we can establish a nation state on our Mother Continent, that would stop a lot of bloodshed and we can coerce the United States economically and politically.
Muhammad Rasheed - We can do all of that from within the USA. we're already a Black Nation composed of different ideological tribes. *shrug* We just have to act like it.
Notes While Observing: The 1972 Gary ConventionOllie Doss - @Muhammad... I think that we can be a "nation within a nation" in the same way that the Chinese are a small nation here, and the Jews are a small nation. However, they're powerful because they have the ultimate power of a mother nation behind them. African descendants of slavery in America are missing that. Therefore, while I agree with this vignette and some of what you're saying, we cannot neglect the fact that we need our own base of operations where WE control the political system. That would make life in America a lot easier and better for the people who want to continue to call this country home.
Muhammad Rasheed - We don't have to form a new nation, we just need to build alliances with other Black African Nations.
Christopher Counts - Well said. I've seen racism as a white living in black communities. I've seen black people live far more affluent and wealthy lives then many other people groups. Change stereotypes and fight ignorance. This whole reparations thing is total bs.
Ollie Doss - @ Muhammad... I agree that we should form alliances with our Brother nations, however African descendants of slavery cannot continue to live in this world without a homeland. We've got to get our own country, and it has to be on the continent of our Mothers and Fathers. Being realistic, we're not going to get full liberation in this country. This is white people's country. Period. They control the context of reality in America. Black people are in no position to actually challenge white power in this country. There was a time when we COULD HAVE taken over America. However, our religious leaders and political figures pushed for integration rather than nation building. So that time has come and gone. Now, we have to face the realities of our situation and work from the standpoint of building to control our own reality. That will never happen in America. A race war, at this point, would be literal biological suicide for us. We cannot fight these people in their house. We've got to establish our own nation and our own power base, and it must be in Africa. There's no other way around that. True, there are perils in trying to obtain land, but I think we can get it done. That's the only way to ensure that black people who live in America will always live in peace and get their reparations.
Muhammad Rasheed - The United States of America that we built with our own hands is our homeland. It's the only home we know.
Muhammad Rasheed - Ollie wrote:
"Black people are in no position to actually challenge white power in this country."I owe the rudimentary freedoms I possess TODAY to the literal rivers of blood that flowed during the Civil War. Please note that I walked out of the cotton fields, picked up a rifle for the first time, and won my freedom In the Name of God.
I will do so again.
#LetMyPeopleGo #ReparationsJohn Slaughter - @Christopher... If you belief that you have been affected by racism then you don't know or understand racism. As a white male you may encounter discrimination in larger black neighborhoods, or even individual acts of bigotry. Anyone is capable of doing that, regardless of race or oppression, but "racism" is a larger systemic problem that affects many people by many people. The difference is important in understanding the larger problem.
Ollie Doss - @Muhammad... The Civil War that the northern whites (reluctantly) allowed our fathers to fight in. It wasn't our people taking power with their own hands. I agree with you, Brother. Our ancestors built this house, but their labor was in vain. We built this house for our enemies thinking that our labor would translate into some type of consolation for us. We have fought in every war for this country, but look at what had to be done to just participate in the wars. Protesting to get into WWI, and they didn't want us fighting for the United States. Most of the black soldiers participated in the war with France. And to come home to the Red Summer of 1919 was an even bigger insult. While we don't hear about the many violent uprisings that our ancestors incited during slavery, none of those uprisings resulted in the taking of power. Because, in the end, we're surrounded by the enemy. They control everything. What supply lines do we control in America? What weapons do we manufacture? What tactical means do we have? I'm not scared to fight, but we're at a crucial point in our history, and we have to be smarter than our enemies. A fight on their soil would be our end. Spartacus learned that.
Muhammad Rasheed - That's literally what they want you to think to prevent you from fighting back again. If you don't fight to the death to protect your freedom -- making the attempt to enslave you unprofitable -- then you can prepare to remain a slave. Period.
Rob Stilfield - Nobody living today deserves reparations, only the people who physically were slaves do. People are always looking to get money from somebody else’s heartaches .
Muhammad Rasheed - Slavery is only one part of the Reparations law suit. The full scope is 400 yrs worth of anti-Black systemic racism. In fact, you owe $10 just for this post.
Rob Stilfield - @Muhammad... black people were not the only slaves at the time. Chinese Native American Mexican and the Irish we’re all apart of slavery too , but none of them are looking for reparations. I believe the Chinese got it worse then anyone.
Ollie Doss - Says a descendant of people who got money from someone else's heartache.
Ollie Doss - I love when white people spit the old "everyone was a slave" bs. This is why I never believed in a dialogue about racism. This is just a white person's way of saying "quit your whining, n****r." They honestly believe that they should be able to sleep in peace on top of their stolen land.
Ollie Doss - Oh well, enough race stuff. The art is great.
Rick Bonilla - If the Indians who actually owned the land never got reparations what makes you think anybody else will. You can check that to business losses.
Rick Bonilla - great art 👍👍👍
Muhammad Rasheed - Rob wrote: "black people were not the only slaves at the time."
That has NOTHING to do with me. I'm fighting my own battle. They can fight theirs.
Muhammad Rasheed - Rick wrote: "If the Indians who actually owned the land never got reparations..."
They received land and other reparatory benefits from the USG and then turned around and paid the freed Blacks they used to own Reparations.
Rob Stilfield - @Muhammad... the thing that keeps racism alive is that we fight only for are own and never along side of any other races . We say stuff like “not my problem “ or “ I have my own battles, they can fight their own” As long as we keep doing this , will never get the support of other races. And there for racism keeps going.
Muhammad Rasheed - Nonsense. The so-called "POCs" are actively working with white supremacy to help exploit Black people. I reject your comment as it is in direct opposition to the truth.
Rob Stilfield - Can I ask a question just for fun, not to start anything, but has anyone ever thought about the possibility of a mixed person who’s black half was once slaves and white half once slave owners . Ironic . But would you owe reparations or be entitled to them ? Would you pay yourself? Hope I didn’t offend anyone, just like to debate sometimes. Everyone have a good day
Vincent Lavarello - How do you think Obama became o wealthy?
Muhammad Rasheed - Selling his books. And speaking fees.
Vincent Lavarello - @Muhammad... he sold his soul to big business, sold his country to the Iranians, about the only thing he isn't selling is his sory books! they already have them in the bargain bins at borders books
Muhammad Rasheed - Meanwhile, he built his wealth from selling his books and from speaking fees.
Vincent Lavarello - So you want your mule and 40 acres of land you were promised after the civil war huh? Let me know how that works out for you dumb democrat ass's!
Muhammad Rasheed - I'll get it alright.
Vincent Lavarello - my my, ain't you the uppitty type, good luck with that sonny!
Muhammad Rasheed - Thanks.
Ollie Doss - This is how you know that your art is awesome!!!
Vincent Lavarello - @Ollie... lol, as an artist I find that comment really stupid, I wasn't about to touch the subject of his racist art with a critique of the quality of his penmanship, but like his racist attitudes his art sucks too!
Muhammad Rasheed - Ollie is correct. Whenever racist whites get over-triggered and foam at the mouth like you are doing here, it confirms me as a successful artist. :)
Thanks btw.
Rob Stilfield - I would also like to state the fact that there Are about 50 million Asians living in slavery today that nobody seems to give a shit about. But as long as you get your reparations from 400 years ago who cares right?
Muhammad Rasheed - How am I going to help them when I'm still suffering under the same ole systemic racism continuously inflicted upon me for the last 400 yrs? #PutYourOwnOxygenMaskOnFirst
Mic Worthy - I just love how the closet racists come out in these posts by M. Rasheed, when all they had to do is ignore the post and scroll on by!
"Hey! My whiteness is under attack! Better defend it by posting a comment to downplay the systemic bigotry still going on today that relegates and marginalizes people of color to make it seem like racism ended with slavery!"Sound about white? LOL
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MEDIUM: Scanned pen & ink cartoon drawing w/Adobe Photoshop color.
